An in depth analysis of Faith of Ice Grand Matron Bow

After extensive testing via gear/damage formula, I have concluded that on a gmb I is 100% pointless.

How diablo 2 calculates damage with weapon based skill:

(((Normal damage x 1.5 [ETH ONLY! Otherwise x 1]) x ( 1 + On weapon ED/100) + Min/Max Damage) x ( 1 + Str or Dex/100 + Off Weapon ED/100 + Skill Damage Bonus/100) + Elemental Damage) x (1 - Skill Damage penalty/100) x 2 [If crit]

Normal damage is the damage of a white item.

Honestly the formula isn't too complex. But let me break down 2 key points.

1: Max damage is added AFTER on weapon ED, not to the normal damage of the weapon making Off Wep ED exponentially stronger.

2: Damage Jewels are bugged. I.e. a 40% ed/15 max will only apply the ED to your MINIMUM DAMAGE. Vice versa with a 40% ED/10 min. A rare jewel with 10-18 damage and 30% ED (3 mods) will not apply ED whatsoever.

Now, let's give a very simple example before heading into my Zons damage with Faith vs FoI so you understand the formula.

The following example shows how to calculate the weapon damage of a rare ethereal great pilum with 32 % enhanced damage and +17 to maximum damage. Great pilum has Normal Damage of 11-26 in melee. Minimum and maximum weapon damages are calculated separately as follows:

Minimum Damage
Base Damage = [11*1.5] = 16

1.5 is the ethereal modifier.

Weapon Damage = 16 + [16*0.32] = 21

0.32 is the percentage bonus from Enhanced Damage.

Maximum damage
Base Damage = [26*1.5] = 39

1.5 is the ethereal modifier.

Weapon Damage = 39 + [39*0.32] + 17 = 68

0.32 is the percentage bonus from Enhanced Damage, and +17 is the direct bonus to maximum damage.

Displayed damage
Thus, the weapon displays the damage of 21-68

The LCS is not so much a liar as people believe. It does lie, a lot. But in the case of my criticism, it is not false whatsoever.

So, let's calculate minimum and then our maximum. With Faith of Ice then with Faith.

(((14) x (3.95) + 34) x ( 1 + 1.52 + 4.2 + 4.28) + 165) [Ignoring 451 poison sc]

(((14) x 3.95) + 34) x (11) + 165)

((55.3) + 34) x 11 + 165

89.3 x 11 + 165

982.3 + 165

1147.3 Minimum Damage. (Correct me if I am wrong, please)

(((72 x 3.95) + 158) x 11 + 165) [Plugged in the same numbers as before and all of my 3 max scs as opposed to without]

(284.4 + 158) x 11 +165

442.4 x 11 + 165

4866.4 + 165

5031.4 Maximum Damage.

1147.3 - 5031.4 Damage with Faith of Ice. As I am extremely lazy, I'm just going to plug in the damage from a regular faith, (+50% on wep ED)

1224.3 - 5427.4 Damage with Faith.

Now, the damage difference is not REALLY that much, but let's go further into the rabbit hole, shall we?

Amulet choices: Well, as a zon you don't have the most options in the amulets department. Main choices being, Cat's Eye, Highlord's, 08 Highlord's. Well, I personally use Cat's Eye. Why? It enables the ias/frw and 25 flat dex (meaning I can have a little bit more than 2k life, enough to take one big hit) Highlords/08 both offer Deadly Strike, as does Faith of Ice.

How Crit + Deadly Strike work:

Chance% = %CS + (1-%CS/100 x %DS)

So with my 71% crit and highlord+FoI 57% Deadly Strike~

71 + (1-71/100 x 57)
71 + (.29 x 57)
71 + (16.53)
87.53% Chance to crit.

Sadly, I don't find this much of a "consolation" prize for using Faith of Ice. Average damage speaking, you still do + or - 100-200 dmg from Faith.


So why use Faith of Ice? In PvP I can't think of a single reason. PvE potentially Ice/Fire arrow builds. I don't know much about them so I cannot comment but as a Physical Damage Bowa, Faith of Ice is NOT worth it. (Especially since 20% ias being removed from any slot does NOT actually have any benefits from what I can find out, Blood Belt isn't really worth)

Side Note: Adding a 10 min/15 max jewel is still lower than using Faith (you lose 40% Off weapon ED and it's actually worse than using a 40/15ias jewel thereby wasting the 20% ias bonus from Faith of Ice.


In conclusion, I feel that Faith of Ice GMB (I assume the same for Mat bow, too lazy to deal with the math right now, I want to actually play the game) should be removed from the FG vendor.

Thanks for reading this long wall of boring text. I hope you now know more about how Diablo 2 works and can make better pvp characters.


ALMOST FORGOT OH GOD EDIT: By the way, the LCS shows 5170 dmg, yet math wise it's really about 250 damage higher (max damage of course)

EDIT 2: I should probably provide a link to the formula + Damage calculator
Formula: http://bfed2.diablomods.ru/site/inde...page=gm_damage
Calculator: http://www.d2region.com/images/guide...mage_calc.html

FOI is used in vanilla d2 PVP for the extra 20ias on GMB bow, allowing you to use a rare 2zon/ 30frw/2os / 3 other stats helm to reach max IAS Break point while using Fort and 2x 15ias jewels in helm.

If you use regular Faith GMB, you have to use a 3os Magic helm with 3x 15ias jewels.

I don't see much benefit, you would lose damage overall to gain, maybe 20 res/str or dex/life? If you want a tankier version of a bowa you should use a mat bow, enables the use of only 44 ias instead of 95. That's just how I view it. On a gmb, I'd rather pump the raw damage potential while still getting 2k life before bo and 260 frw.

Edit: phone typing is shit.

Mat Bow for pro telezon ofc

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vorpvp

I don't see much benefit, you would lose damage overall to gain, maybe 20 res/str or dex/life? If you want a tankier version of a bowa you should use a mat bow, enables the use of only 44 ias instead of 95. That's just how I view it. On a gmb, I'd rather pump the raw damage potential while still getting 2k life before bo and 260 frw.

Edit: phone typing is shit.

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Best circ is 2 zon / 30 frw / 20 dex / 30 str / 20 Res / 2 sockets with 2x 40/15 jewels or 2x 15/15 jewels

The added skills are for extra dodge etc skills and the dex / str give you more life and dex (damage) and res.

I'm sorry but FOI GMB is the best PVP bow in the game as the best zon setup is:
FOI GMB
Fort of chains or reg Fort
Rare zon circlet mentioned above
Cats eye
2 pass / 20ias / KB /15 str / 15 dex gloves
Perf Raven
9 min / str / dex / Res ring (option form2 other stat or crafted blood ring with those 4 stats for extra str)
War Travs or gores
Nos coil


this allows high Res, high damage, high dodge, max Ias, max GM run speed with 5frw scs, high life for a glass cannon zon


Your idea to use a mat bow is a flawed idea as the damage is to low and it is to easy to hit max Ias with a FOI GMB.



Sorry, you wasted your time with all your incorrect math.

And if you are going for damage, foi is worse. Facts are facts. The only thing the Zon circ adds is str/res. +2 to zon MIGHT gain 1% of dodge. Hardly worth a loss of 40% off wep ED. Nor is the 10% you gain via +2 to ga.

You can argue the dex, as that is 20% dmg but unless you are glass cannon you only put stats for gear. Math is correct. Maybe not the idea you are thinking of/what is "best" as a skilled player can use worse gear and win a 1v1, it is pure numeral values to what the damage difference is. And join d2pk with your "best build" because again, no Zons I know of run it and I don't play nl d2.

I have a pretty good tele bow zon build. I dont use GMB bow tho. I use mat FoI Bow

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lockzilla

I have a pretty good tele bow zon build. I dont use GMB bow tho. I use mat FoI Bow

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Couldn't ever get behind Telezon. Feels wrong to me.

Its fun. Different.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lockzilla

Its fun. Different.

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And strong, if I may add :)

yes people use foi on regular d2 realms to hit max ga ias bps with a rare circ, that doesnt mean its good. the problem with this is the fact that when they switch to their jav side they lose a light fury bp. most people arent really smart enough to realize the importance of this. they just see an extra 20% ias and think "omg its so good". they'd probably be better off using a dungos instead of the rare circ tbh. as far as the math behind the damage goes ill leave that to chef.

the only time Id personally use a foi is on something like a ward / diamond/ shadow bow faith with an eth 40ias jav on switch.

this allows you to not only use a rare circ, it also allows you to give up a 40/15 in one of the slots in favor of something like a 30ed/9dex/9str or 4rep/30cold res or 10 all res jewel or even a 30 max damage jewel if you wish since the ed min max bug doesnt apply in particular situations. Its been a long time since I actually tested the usefulness of a 30 max damage jewel tbh so i cant remember which exact build prefers it, but Iirc it depends on the amount of dex you use on your bowa.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vorpvp

And if you are going for damage, foi is worse. Facts are facts. The only thing the Zon circ adds is str/res. +2 to zon MIGHT gain 1% of dodge. Hardly worth a loss of 40% off wep ED. Nor is the 10% you gain via +2 to ga.

You can argue the dex, as that is 20% dmg but unless you are glass cannon you only put stats for gear. Math is correct. Maybe not the idea you are thinking of/what is "best" as a skilled player can use worse gear and win a 1v1, it is pure numeral values to what the damage difference is. And join d2pk with your "best build" because again, no Zons I know of run it and I don't play nl d2.

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as far as your statement about the dex goes and whether the stats are worth a loss of 40% damage, unless you are a glass cannon (in which case just roll a diff class cuz youre bad) the dex just gives an additional 60 life before bo like you said. BUT the whole concept behind a vita bow is that a dead zon doesnt do any damage so investing in your survivability may lower your dps but increases your damage done over the course of a duel and wins duels for you. as far as survivability goes your effective health pool increases pretty drastically with minor investments into your survivability on a zon which is why its ok to lose out on a little damage in exchange for some resists and life etc etc. so the point im making is that the stats are an indirect damage increase not a direct one. and honestly youd probably have a rough time calculating that because with damage its just a regular formula that has been provided that you can plug numbers into. the effective heal pool vs damage formula is so situationally based that most people dont bother to do the math they just try it out and say "wow i actually win with this". with that being said its such a good feeling seeing a creation of mine become the go-to build when for so long people were all about glass cannons haha. ah the good old days.

foi gmb is still shit tho. same with foi mb

damn this topic is so deep. what i wanna know is... jewels dont give dmg if they got %ed on them? shit i didn't know that

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Originally Posted by nedamettin

damn this topic is so deep. what i wanna know is... jewels dont give dmg if they got %ed on them? shit i didn't know that

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If a jewel gives +to minimum damage, +to maximum damage, or both with ed% on them, it will bug if it is not in your weapon slot.

For instance, if I put on a 40%/15 max jewel. Say I wanna throw that in my helm. What will happen is, I gain 15 max damage and 40% increased minimum damage. Or vice versa. if I have a rare jewel with say, 30% ED/9 max/4 min and put it in my helm, it has 0 effect at all. It's a weird thing with jewels. If you were to put that same 40%/15 max in your weapon, however, it would work perfectly fine.

im talking about anni's sake and not d2pk, would %ed lph be better than lets say... dragon jewels?

Well, this is a pk thread.. I'll answer but in the future you should make a thread on the anni subforum.

Either way, it doesn't matter. A 60% ED/high lph jewel in anni is WAY better than a Dragon jewel, but a dragon jewel also has phys/magic res and since magic res is hard to come by, dragon jewels are very good. People don't give them as much props as they should imho