GOLD VENDOR FIRST WEEK DISCUSSION THREAD

Game told me to post one if I want to discuss this further, so here you go.

*new ladder wipe*

-stack tons of gold
-spam infernal chests
-tyraels might
-profit

Who wants this to happen again? Only a few people who has the gold for it most likely. I sincerely think that even people who have large amount of gold don't want this. They have to because there is an option and this server is relatively competitive for the first month. EVEN having a set at the first day is a huge advantage against people who doesn't have gold or simply doesn't want to use this cheesy method to start.

As the runes are removed from gold vendor for the first week of ladder wipes, all the goods available EXCEPT the visual effects should be removed. Even organs can make things so imbalanced if you think like this:

-get a casual bowzon with freezing arrows
-die 15871348123 times to azatoth and defeat in the end
-get into cow level with a barb
-most likely you will get 2-3 elite uniques per run with huge xp

There is NO way cows can kill a bowzon with mavina set or EVEN without. They are frozen all the time. Summoners can easily run cows aswell with CE and Confusion curse. And this is NOTHING compared to having a full set out of infernal chests, a chance (which is high if you buy hundreds like people did before) to have a game-breaking rare elite and moving around with a lot of +hp +res charms.

If you think no one would do this, you may ask Scotty or Mephisto or some rich people (gold or real money wise) who love this mod. I criticize a lot and sometimes that is even considered bitching, but I love this mod aswell. This feature is NOT fun though.

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Originally Posted by nedamettin

Game told me to post one if I want to discuss this further, so here you go.

*new ladder wipe*

-stack tons of gold
-spam infernal chests
-tyraels might
-profit

Who wants this to happen again? Only a few people who has the gold for it most likely. I sincerely think that even people who have large amount of gold don't want this. They have to because there is an option and this server is relatively competitive for the first month. EVEN having a set at the first day is a huge advantage against people who doesn't have gold or simply doesn't want to use this cheesy method to start.

As the runes are removed from gold vendor for the first week of ladder wipes, all the goods available EXCEPT the visual effects should be removed. Even organs can make things so imbalanced if you think like this:

-get a casual bowzon with freezing arrows
-die 15871348123 times to azatoth and defeat in the end
-get into cow level with a barb
-most likely you will get 2-3 elite uniques per run with huge xp

There is NO way cows can kill a bowzon with mavina set or EVEN without. They are frozen all the time. Summoners can easily run cows aswell with CE and Confusion curse. And this is NOTHING compared to having a full set out of infernal chests, a chance (which is high if you buy hundreds like people did before) to have a game-breaking rare elite and moving around with a lot of +hp +res charms.

If you think no one would do this, you may ask Scotty or Mephisto or some rich people (gold or real money wise) who love this mod. I criticize a lot and sometimes that is even considered bitching, but I love this mod aswell. This feature is NOT fun though.

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Please read my post here: http://annihilus.net/showthread.php?t=11578&page=2 . Some people may have to give up some of their "fun" if they want the server to grow and receive new content. A lot of people aren't seeing the full picture here.

Also, nobody has EVER bought hundreds of Infernal Chests, trust me, me and my PayPal would know. Also that logic is pretty crazy, someone will complete ONE set if they buy hundreds of chests? I'll win thousands of dollars in the lottery if I go buy hundreds of tickets I guess... lol

remove following items from hadriel for at least one month after reset:
-Runes
-Infernal chests
-Organ baskets
-Frag baskets
-Ench scrolls

And also:
- Decrease droprate of uniqs/sets for ryleh, infernal cows, and other inf areas.
- Remove puzzle boxes from cache of ryleh when opening with key (this is retarded)
- Fix droprate for puzzleboxes (item find droprate is much higher then initial kill)

ty men

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Originally Posted by Game

Please read my post here: http://annihilus.net/showthread.php?t=11578&page=2 . Some people may have to give up some of their "fun" if they want the server to grow and receive new content. A lot of people aren't seeing the full picture here.

Also, nobody has EVER bought hundreds of Infernal Chests, trust me, me and my PayPal would know. Also that logic is pretty crazy, someone will complete ONE set if they buy hundreds of chests? I'll win thousands of dollars in the lottery if I go buy hundreds of tickets I guess... lol

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I was in a game on the first day of the last reset where someone did just that. I happened to be in town when the guy started opening Infernal Chests at Hadriel. I know what this looks like because I've done it many times in single player. By the time he was done spamming chests the entire screen was filled with loot. Most of it was garbage but I just sat there and cherry picked the stuff that he didn't want so I could get started. Now it may not have been hundreds of chests but I know from experience on single player that you can get a full set from 50+ chests. RNG plays into it of course but I've done it. People were talking about having already completed full Mavina's and other sets within hours of the reset while we were all leveling together. Maybe they were full of crap. Who knows?

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Originally Posted by Game

Please read my post here: http://annihilus.net/showthread.php?t=11578&page=2 . Some people may have to give up some of their "fun" if they want the server to grow and receive new content. A lot of people aren't seeing the full picture here.

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If you give up the "fun" to play and "have fun" in a private server, that's kind of weird. I'm not playing the game right now because competition is zero since everyone has everything and there is no thrill of finding a good item. I also love trading in D2 and there is almost none at the moment. First two months of the ladder wipes are my times and it is diminished by the fact that some people will be ahead of others because they pay an absurd amount of real money or stacked gold 6 months ago.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Game

Also, nobody has EVER bought hundreds of Infernal Chests, trust me, me and my PayPal would know. Also that logic is pretty crazy, someone will complete ONE set if they buy hundreds of chests? I'll win thousands of dollars in the lottery if I go buy hundreds of tickets I guess... lol

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You don't need hundreds of chests to get a set. It still has been done before. Scotty threw dozens of charms to me which he said he got from inf chests he opened at start of the wipe.

And the argument "I'll win thousands of dollars in the lottery if I go buy hundreds of tickets." is so wrong for this subject because you convert gold into items that is NOT gold or can't be bought directly with gold in the end. In your example you buy tickets with money to make money which is completely different and retarded in my opinion (I never play lottery).

Also if there aren't many people who are buying infernal chests at the start of a wipe, why don't you remove them for the first week since it is not a big deal for you?

I just answered your post to answer. I know it is completely your decision and I won't be able to change your mind.

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Originally Posted by Lampogriz

remove following items from hadriel for at least one month after reset:
-Runes
-Infernal chests
-Organ baskets
-Frag baskets
-Ench scrolls

And also:
- Decrease droprate of uniqs/sets for ryleh, infernal cows, and other inf areas.
- Remove puzzle boxes from cache of ryleh when opening with key (this is retarded)
- Fix droprate for puzzleboxes (item find droprate is much higher then initial kill)

ty men

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Nothing will be removed for longer than a week, sorry :( Also drop rates have been lowered twice in Patch 4.2 alone, do you read the patch notes? :) As for the drop rate of puzzles and find item, this is COMPLETELY a placebo effect. Find Item literally just re-rolls the monster drop again, except it's chance of not dropping anything is related to Find Item level, not the amount of players in the game. I will probably nerf Find Item a little though.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by LordManhammer

I was in a game on the first day of the last reset where someone did just that. I happened to be in town when the guy started opening Infernal Chests at Hadriel. I know what this looks like because I've done it many times in single player. By the time he was done spamming chests the entire screen was filled with loot. Most of it was garbage but I just sat there and cherry picked the stuff that he didn't want so I could get started. Now it may not have been hundreds of chests but I know from experience on single player that you can get a full set from 50+ chests. RNG plays into it of course but I've done it. People were talking about having already completed full Mavina's and other sets within hours of the reset while we were all leveling together. Maybe they were full of crap. Who knows?

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50 is nowhere near hundreds, thats a large difference. Even then I don't think it was more than 20-30, I know who you're talking about I do believe. And it is as you said, RNG is RNG. It could take 20 chests to get a set, or it could take 500.

I dont see much competitive at a ladder start. After 3 days the whole content is clear and some1 is posting proud the first cowset of the realm. On the next day you can buy it for a ridiculous amount of golddonation because he found most of his endgamegear already.

Oh and that has been the last ladder, where hadriel was disabled for roughly 6 days.

If you have the time, the team and the knowledge you dont need hadriel at all.

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Originally Posted by Lucid

I dont see much competitive at a ladder start. After 3 days the whole content is clear and some1 is posting proud the first cowset of the realm. On the next day you can buy it for a ridiculous amount of golddonation because he found most of his endgamegear already.

Oh and that has been the last ladder, where hadriel was disabled for roughly 6 days.

If you have the time, the team and the knowledge you dont need hadriel at all.

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I never bought gold in this server but made a lot of people buy gold for my stuff. At some point I had 30k+ gold but I used them for cosmetics and stuff.

I don't need Hadriel, but I still don't like the fact that some people will be ahead of others because they pay money. Takes away that bit of competition we have and trading is also diminished because people who start with better gear will reach end-game much faster.

Yea but the endgame is clear after three days. I dont see a reason to cut hadriel away for more than a few days.

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Originally Posted by nedamettin

I never bought gold in this server but made a lot of people buy gold for my stuff. At some point I had 30k+ gold but I used them for cosmetics and stuff.

I don't need Hadriel, but I still don't like the fact that some people will be ahead of others because they pay money. Takes away that bit of competition we have and trading is also diminished because people who start with better gear will reach end-game much faster.

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The people who band together and race to 99 as a group always leave the individuals in the dust. No matter what advantages the individuals might have. There are also some builds right now that can farm inferno portals without even wearing gear:) This next reset will be interesting.

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Originally Posted by Game

Nothing will be removed for longer than a week, sorry :( Also drop rates have been lowered twice in Patch 4.2 alone, do you read the patch notes? :)

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yes i read patch notes, but drop rates was not enough lowered ofc

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lucid

Yea but the endgame is clear after three days. I dont see a reason to cut hadriel away for more than a few days.

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Not for everyone.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by LordManhammer

The people who band together and race to 99 as a group always leave the individuals in the dust. No matter what advantages the individuals might have. There are also some builds right now that can farm inferno portals without even wearing gear:) This next reset will be interesting.

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Playing a meta build or grouping up is the nature of hardcore multiplayer gaming. Nothing can prevent this. No game can have a %100 balance. I am pretty sure druids and sins will be the elite groups as always. I for myself will go anti-meta and start with necro and trade the druid goodies I'll find to gear up even faster.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lampogriz

yes i read patch notes, but drop rates was not enough lowered ofc

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Yay let's make mobs have 1% chance to drop an item period (just a single magic jewel) so that way there is no gear at all and people bitch some more.
Let's face it, who cares about regular set items, it's all about late game items that have set drop rates (think crucible, it will always drop an item no matter what)

The system is fine the way it is. It brings money to the server, people who have money ALWAYS had an advantage in ANY GIVEN game whether it's this one, WoW, POE, etc, etc.
Money can buy anything so your logic is flawed from the get go

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Originally Posted by wdzepplin

Yay let's make mobs have 1% chance to drop an item period (just a single magic jewel) so that way there is no gear at all and people bitch some more.

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i didint say to make 1% chance, you failed

the dropchances are fine for me. Im not one of these pros, farming a single spot the whole day. I have like 2-3 hours on regular workdays that i spend farming all possible spots. And that way the dropchances atm feel ok.

I can imagine tho, that when you play 24/7 the ladder gets boring after 2-3 weeks

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lucid

the dropchances are fine for me. Im not one of these pros, farming a single spot the whole day. I have like 2-3 hours on regular workdays that i spend farming all possible spots. And that way the dropchances atm feel ok.

I can imagine tho, that when you play 24/7 the ladder gets boring after 2-3 weeks

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Exactly and pretty much all games will feel dull if you play non stop. It will be even worse if the drop chances are nerfed to the ground for casual players that cannot afford to spend more than few hours here and there to play because of life obligations (family, work, friends, hobbies, etc)

*takes a deep breath and sips some coffee*

- Gold is the progress you save when playing months before ladder reset, apparently most of the top Gold players have hardly donated, instead they earned it, so by definition that is not pay to win.

- Although this goes against the spirit of resetting the ladder, I understand it is necessary to keep players engaged, focused on the next ladder, participate in events, and make money and votes for the server

- The items sold by Hadriel is the real question, not the concept of Gold itself, people think it won't be competitive after the 1st week of ladder when the items are added back, and I don't believe that to be true

- Drop rates are not a real problem, only an imagined one, because we are all playing with the same rates. The difference in opinion comes from arguing over how long it should take you to be fully geared.

- Game has said in another thread, and I agree, that the best way to progress is playing all the time, and spending gold is slower progress by comparison, but with the exception of Chests/Keys, which is buying end-game items and I'll cover this next.

- Personally I think 1 week with no Hadriel vendor at all, then add the RNG items like chests/keys/organ/frag bags, then 1 week after that add the Runes back

- It will help the nostalgia for advanced players to have 0 help from gold at the start, then starting with RNG items, and Runes after that, making sure everyone is on equal terms during the early grind-fest period. Adding Chests/Bags back after 1 week and Runes back after 2 weeks is not unreasonable, because by then the trade economy will be getting more serious and Runes will serve a minimal purpose for the first week.

I think everyone is just overthinking this and worried over nothing.
Last ladder I started with barely any gold at all and as everyone can see now, I have more than "barely any".
And most of my gold is from selling all my items from this current ladder, which everyone has a chance to do.
I have not spent 1 cent of my own money to purchase any of the gold I have now.
And for the last few months I haven't spent any of my gold on anything just to save up for next ladder.
And I don't intend to waste it on infernal chests when I could use it much more wisely later on.
Also 10,000 of my gold is from voting which everyone has the ability to do, so everyone has the same chances.
The people complaining that everyone with a lot of gold will have an advantage shouldn't have spent all their gold.
Or if they were smart they would've sold all of their gear for gold just like I and many others have done.
Also as long as voting is an option, no one has a bigger advantage than anyone else, we all get gold somehow.
I could go on more about this but I have places to be, everyone just stop worrying and get back to having fun!

Ladder reset is so dumb.

All I hear people say is :

I want to play the game without access to any items and not being rushed.

Answer:

Just play the game, how it was intended, without being rushed. Your problem is solved.


No matter what the admins do, the rich will always get richer. There will never be a level playing field.


This game is not setup to have a ladder reset nor care about who gets to lvl 99 first.

This game is based around PVP, with leveling and gear making your character better in ththe PVP arena. There just never will be enough content / difficulty for this to be a PVM game, similar to Final Fantasy 11.


Make a PVP ladder and all th problems are solved.

The community is not large enough to support NL and ladder. Even in the community in vanilla D2, all ladder is is a MF haven. Then people play / PVP on NL and sell the good items they found on ladder, to NL when it rolls over.


ladder resets, especially with a minimal community size, lead to economy disruption and play decrease because no one is actually playing right now because people are just waiting for reset.

That is why no trades are happening and all the games available are just advertising their FT list to sel for gold.

Why is this so hard for people Understand?

Having a ladder reset is completely retarded.

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Originally Posted by Ukon

Ladder reset is so dumb.

All I hear people say is :

I want to play the game without access to any items and not being rushed.

Answer:

Just play the game, how it was intended, without being rushed. Your problem is solved.


No matter what the admins do, the rich will always get richer. There will never be a level playing field.


This game is not setup to have a ladder reset nor care about who gets to lvl 99 first.

This game is based around PVP, with leveling and gear making your character better in ththe PVP arena. There just never will be enough content / difficulty for this to be a PVM game, similar to Final Fantasy 11.


Make a PVP ladder and all th problems are solved.

The community is not large enough to support NL and ladder. Even in the community in vanilla D2, all ladder is is a MF haven. Then people play / PVP on NL and sell the good items they found on ladder, to NL when it rolls over.


ladder resets, especially with a minimal community size, lead to economy disruption and play decrease because no one is actually playing right now because people are just waiting for reset.

That is why no trades are happening and all the games available are just advertising their FT list to sel for gold.

Why is this so hard for people Understand?

Having a ladder reset is completely retarded.

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Sadly people usually don't play the game normally unless their forced to, theirs a certain realness to doing it from scratch.
Also sadly no one wants to play Non Ladder and also then that splits up the players even more.
I could easily give another example similar to what you're saying, its the same thing as Hardcore.
People could just play the same style as Hardcore but on Softcore and just never die on Softcore.
It would be the exact same as Hardcore is, but people just prefer the realness of knowing if they die it's over.
And if you're saying this server revolves around PVP that is just absurd, the least popular activity is PVP.
Lack of PVP has always been one of the biggest problems about Diablo 2 in my opinion.
And yeah the rich will always get richer, because they put effort into it and love the game and enjoy playing.
What you're saying is basically like saying anyone who's rich in the world doesnt deserve to be even if they worked for it.
Annihilus may be a game but it's not much different than real life, it's unfair and you dont always get what you want.
There are plenty of things even I would like to change about this server, but It's not my choice and I accept that.

Ukon, I am glad you have an opinion on how you think the game should be, but sadly your opinion is at odds to what the majority of people here want.

We will be resetting ladder for the third time in march.

Hopefully you'll still be playing here for the reset, and when the reset happens you'll see why a reset on annihilus is different than regular diablo 2.

Summon necro with CE can clear anything in regular game naked. With minimal gear, inferno portals in a5. Even faster now that you don't need corpses to raise skellies. Throw in a fana pally for support, and he's gonna be a beast as soon as he's leveled.

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Originally Posted by Brimstonejack

summon druid with CE can clear anything in regular game naked. With minimal gear, inferno portals in a5. Even faster now that you don't need corpses to raise skellies. Throw in a fana pally for support, and he's gonna be a beast as soon as he's leveled.

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Druid? O_O

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Originally Posted by Game

Druid? O_O

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Necro. my bad.

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Originally Posted by Brimstonejack

Necro. my bad.

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That's what they do though they cheese things down with massive tanks. There is no real middle ground unfortunately for a summoner necromancer. They are slow to kill without proper gear though, and definitely won't be doing actual bosses without proper gear.

I'm not complaining. I'm just pointing out that they're a good way to get started.

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Originally Posted by Brimstonejack

I'm not complaining. I'm just pointing out that they're a good way to get started.

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Oh I know :)